Healthy Exits

The Preamble: Does this happen to you? When I begin mulling a certain topic, my brain finds alignment with the theme or concept and before I know it, I have a line-up of scenarios, moments, memories that fall into the same bucket of consideration. It’s fantastic, this awareness business 😉 and it makes me think I ought to spend time contemplating bigger issues.

Intent + focus = insight

Last week’s podcast chat, Smiles from the Unemployment Office must’ve triggered thoughts about my own workplace identities. Combined with a splendid encounter with a former student? I can see the interwoven threads. See what you think…


A former student reached out to me last week and asked the mother of all questions. Maybe I exaggerate? But it was a good, good one. Read on…

We’ll call my student Martin.  He was a young adult – in his mid-twenties when I met him ten years ago. He felt like a fish out of water because he wasn’t fresh out of high school but still wore the label of ‘first year student’ amidst the 18-year-olds. He was vulnerable, unsure and felt he’d missed the bus…couldn’t compete with his younger peers. But he was wrong. Martin’s enthusiasm and work ethic were unmatched. He just didn’t know it yet.

Martin knew me as a faculty member, a Dean and a counselor.  It didn’t happen often, but there were times in my higher ed life when students would encounter all versions of “Vicki” – my varying identities and roles. When those overlaps occurred, I needed to be careful about boundary setting. Reminding students which hat I wore depending upon the circumstance. Here’s what I mean:

Vicki as professor? One version of me…I’ve got a syllabus and I know how to use it.  In my teaching role, distinct rules and expectations were defined. I was a stickler about being on time for class and the chunk of the syllabus about behavioral expectations (especially regarding respect, diversity and inclusion expectations and behavior in online discussion boards) was LENGTHY. But there was levity…lightness. We had snacks. Even though eating and drinking in class was strictly prohibited, my friends in Facilities knew I’d tidy up…and so would my students. Leave no donut dust behind. Yep. Those words. On the syllabus. Martin remembered the ‘donut dust’ point and said he still smiles about it whenever he eats a messy, powdered sugar donut. 😉 And yes. We ate fruit and other healthier nibbles, too.

Vicki as the Dean? The version of me that managed a large team and multiple functions, all with excellence in student services in mind. Martin knew that Vicki because he was a student worker in one of our offices, which helped to reduce his tuition costs.  (I just realized, Martin also knew me as a mom, seeing daughter Delaney accompany me to work every now and then. Delaney called that part of me “Meeting Momma” because she thought my days were ultra dull. And told me so. Often.)

Vicki as a counselor/therapist? The version of me that displayed her license and credentials in a prominent place, per State regulations. The version of me that followed a distinct protocol with session notes, secured and private. The Vicki that wanted to build rapport but knew better than to rush. Listening for understanding and allowing trust to be built, however long that took…was job #1. Even though parameters and limitations were set as to the number of times students could be seen before outside referrals occurred, I broke those rules often (and documented accordingly) if I sensed momentum was afoot. Martin and I worked together to address challenges he faced but it took time to break through his protective veneer of anger and disappointment.


When Martin emailed me and asked to chat, I was thrilled to hear from him, but I was cautious about which version of me he intended to tap. Some roles I’ve left behind, some I’ve retained in new forms. What surprised me the most was how aware he was of all of that. He’s been following me in my business ventures, book writing and consulting, praising me for my pivots. Hmm. I hadn’t thought of my career path in that way…Martin might’ve had a future as a counselor if he wasn’t so darn talented in other ways.

We met over coffee last week and Martin said he had a particular question in mind.  Here it comes:

“How do you know when it’s time to make a healthy exit?”

You know where my first thoughts went. Questions about the who, what, where, when…exit from….??? But instead, I said:

“Now that – that right there is a question isn’t it?  He smiled. I smiled back and added, “Sounds like you might be approaching a crossroads, wondering about making a decision?”

Martin continued and for about twenty minutes he shared a workplace dilemma where he’s convinced his boss is lying to him about his promotion potential…feeling overlooked and placated as supervisory roles are doled out to employees with lesser credentials but greater schmoozy skills.

When he finished his sketch of the problem, I asked him about the options he’s considered, and he smiled again.

 “I knew you’d ask that. Right. I have a job offer and I think it’s a good one but I’m afraid. Which is why I want to know.  How do you know when it’s time to make a life change…do the things I’ve seen you do. Make healthy exits and move on?”

I don’t say anything yet. I’m thinking. Then Martin adds,

“And I read your book. The one about your mom. Wow. You moved so often and it wasn’t your choice…your mom was a lot and look at you. How did you learn to be confident about your choices when you finally got to choose – not just where you lived, but your career choices, too?”

I’m not often at a loss for words. Martin gave me a bushel basket full of gifts along with the hope that I could tell him what to do. I might be an exemplar to him – the picture of someone who’s managed a lot with a dash of patience, forgiveness and grace, but I don’t have a prescription for what he does next. And he knows it.

I say:

“I love that you found me so we could catch up. I love that you read my book and see the resiliency threads, the courage to keep going, but I’m not special or remarkable. I had plenty of people cheering me on and always felt like an ‘exit’ or a change was healthy if I was excited about what came next. You’re right. Being the chooser helps but trusting ourselves is tricky. It requires practice. Building confidence. But you already knew that didn’t you?”

Martin nodded, sipped his coffee and began talking about the job offer in question. His excitement was obvious and although he knew he didn’t need to convince me that it was a good opportunity, I could see he’d come to that conclusion on his own. 

“Last week I would’ve quit on the spot, I was so angry. I wanted to tell my boss off but I know that’s not the way. I’ve written a resignation letter and I’ll give him two weeks because it’s the right thing to do. I’ll regret it if I don’t give the new job a shot.”

How many words did I speak in our coffee chat? Not many. Even for Verbose Vicki. What Martin needed is what we all need from time to time. A listening post, caring ears, ready to receive.

Healthy exits, graceful exits…listening to the wisdom within. I know you’ll join me in wishing “Martin” good luck! Thanks so much for coming along.

Vicki 😊

More…favorite posts about students:

Lizette’s 4-Steps – Victoria Ponders

Like a Rainbow – Victoria Ponders

Check out this link for more about “Surviving Sue”

Surviving Sue | Eckhartz Press



62 responses to “Healthy Exits”

  1. drgeraldstein Avatar
    drgeraldstein

    Nice job, pun intended, Vicki. Sounds like he was looking for the permission to take a risk from someone he admired and trusted. Sometimes waiting for the other’s ideas is all that is needed.

    Liked by 3 people

    1. I think you’re right…permission to take that next step. A little boost (to paraphrase the wise Milton Stein). 🥰

      Liked by 1 person

  2. How wonderful that Martin thought about during this fork in the road moment in his life and that you were, in all your various roles, to guide him. I think what you said was very wise and helpful.

    And it is interesting to think about the different personas we possess and which we draw on in the context of a given situation. Professor, Dean, Counsellor, all important and impressive roles!

    Liked by 2 people

    1. I like how you put that, Ab. We all need ‘guides’…and although I’ve had some titles in my life, nothing’s more important than being human in the moment. Giving…and for me, very often…receiving, too! 🥰

      Liked by 1 person

  3. drgeraldstein Avatar
    drgeraldstein

    Thanks for mentioning my dad, Vicki. He probably would have referred to the bad boss’s behavior and said, “Every knock is a boost,” a mantra that got him through the Great Depression.

    Liked by 1 person

    1. Yes! That phrase has stuck with me since the first time you shared it. A little Milton to remind us that adversity can foster motivation…or at least that’s how I embrace his wisdom. Thanks, Dr. Stein! 🥰

      Liked by 1 person

    1. Aw…thanks, LA! 🥰

      Liked by 1 person

  4. drgeraldstein Avatar
    drgeraldstein

    Thanks, Vicki. The Great Depression motivated the 25% of a work force without work, and the 25% who has some work, but were underemployed. Though I never asked him, I think that mantra allowed him to keep trying, when every other thought would have led him to despair. Had he given up, I probably wouldn’t be here.

    Liked by 1 person

    1. The fact that those words are still on the tip of your tongue…and are impactful for others? Your dear father continues to inspire. I feel that. Hard won wisdom is the best, I think and your reminder about your dad’s context adds so much meaning. Thank you again. 💕

      Like

  5. This is fantastic! It was a win for both sides. Who knew you would each receive this gift from each other on this meeting day? I love when worlds intersect overtime and place and this is the perfect example. I never really phrased it this way to myself, but I have done this my entire life with some bad situations and some good situations guessing hoping knowing and believing that the next thing would be better even if it was scary to make the change and not for sure. I think this is why I understand you so well you have done the same thing throughout your life. What I found as a result is that it has always been better once I settle into it and accepted as it is. This happened recently when I decided a year ago that I would retire after this year of school I was happy I loved what I did. I knew it was time for a change. I made and settling into my next chapter. I know that you offered this former student a tremendous gift and he now knows it as well

    Liked by 3 people

    1. You are so sweet, Beth. And you picked up on a nuance I didn’t add…for fear of boring/tiring out readers…I think what Martin experienced about decision making and ‘wondering’ is so, so, so applicable to friends who are transitioning into retirement…new adventures. Yes! You got me, girl. Thanks much for all of that. (And side note – “Martin” will probably be reading and he will LOVE your comment and the observation about settling in/settling down. Almost exact words that he used.)
      xo, dear one! 🥰

      Like

  6. I love this post, Vicki. It reminds me of the continuing roles we can have in our students’ lives if we have made meaningful connections. I’m not entirely sure that I ever consciously set boundaries as a faculty member, dean, or in other admin roles, although I’m sure they were assumed by many students. I just know that I cherish the lifelong relationships I’ve been able to maintain with many of my former students (some who are retiring already!), which does sometimes include them reaching out for assurance/sharing wrt new ventures. Thanks for a great post. 😊💕

    Liked by 2 people

    1. Thank you so much, Jane. I’m going to share something with you! You’re often in my head/heart when I write these posts about former students because I’ve loved the connection we’ve made about cherishing our higher ed roles…and the relationships we built with colleagues and students. Appreciate you, my friend! 🥰🥰🥰

      Liked by 1 person

      1. many thanks, Vicki. Right back at you!! 💕

        Liked by 1 person

  7. Oh, the different roles we play. No matter the role, what a wonderful thing that he came back to you for advice and to check in with you. It shows how much you’ve played a part in his success and future. Yes, you might not have said much, but he trusted you with his inner most thoughts. A wonderful post Vicki!

    Liked by 1 person

    1. Thanks much, Brian. I think that thought – having a few chosen people in our lives aligns so nicely with your posts this morning. Love when that happens. 🥰

      Like

      1. Oh, yes, I had the same thought. You’re reading my crazy brain Vicki. My sympathies. I feel for you. Ha, ha. No, I love when there are similiarities of thought and understanding. Neat to see.

        Liked by 1 person

  8. What a special relationship, and a good question. I’m just having the same conversation with my son, whose loyalty exceeds his ability to honour personal boundaries.

    Liked by 1 person

    1. Yes, VJ – you’re right. Loyalty and commitment can get in the way. Beautiful point. Sending good wishes to your son. ❤️

      Liked by 1 person

  9. How heartwarming to have the opportunity to touch the life of another—and have our own touched in return.

    Liked by 1 person

    1. Thank you for that, dear Jules and for being that beautiful gift for me and so many others.
      ❤️❤️❤️

      Liked by 1 person

  10. I’m so glad that Martin has decided to reach into the new opportunity and came to the conclusion himself. You are an excellent guide Vicki, gently bringing him to that conclusion. The only thing holding him back was fear of the unknown and though that’s difficult to tackle, there’s often much beauty beyond it. And he moved with grace and integrity. He obviously learned a lot from your many selves. Ah you’re amazing. And so is Martin! 💕

    Liked by 1 person

    1. You’re waaay too kind! I love your words…”gently bringing him to that conclusion.” Gentle! Yes! So important as we sit with each other – virtually or in person. Xo! 🥰

      Liked by 1 person

      1. So true! It is about sitting with each other. 💕

        Liked by 1 person

  11. No wonder he chose you to mull things over with. As someone once told me, “You gave me the nudge I needed.” Bless you, Vicki!

    Liked by 1 person

    1. Don’t we love the ones who nudge us? So affirming when we can do the same for others. Xo, Joy! ❤️

      Liked by 1 person

  12. I have always thought most folks are inherently resistant to change, so it would track that when they themselves are contemplating enacting change, they pause as well. Vicki, I think here you outlined a fine example of what those people need sometimes the most…not good advice but a good listener. Good listening is often the best form of communication there is. I enjoyed this meeting, and this post, a lot.🙂

    Liked by 2 people

    1. Can you see me smiling, Bruce? 😊 You made my day! Thank you so much. I think you’re on to something…listening being the most important thing in the world sometimes. It heals hurts in ways we can’t imagine. Appreciate the feedback! 🥰

      Liked by 2 people

  13. I’m so impressed with all your pivots and experience. Yes, that’s a good question. When to exit. My son’s boss was fired and he put his hat in the ring because he knows what needs to be done in that position. He’s at a crossroads because the CEO told him, “No, we’re hiring someone from outside the company.” My son’s move was to stay in his job, but to apply to Berkeley’s MBA program.

    Liked by 1 person

    1. Oh…all the best to your son. What a terrific next step for him – an MBA from Berkeley! Thanks so much for your lovely comment, Elizabeth! 🥰

      Liked by 1 person

      1. Thanks! The post grad degree from Berkeley is something we’ve been pushing for years. But he had to discover this for himself and want to do it.

        Liked by 1 person

        1. Ahhh. I hear you! Needed time to “marinate”. 😉

          Like

          1. Yes, exactly! Or, he came to a dead end in his career. Now, he has to get accepted 🤞

            Liked by 1 person

            1. I’ll think good thoughts for him! 🥰

              Liked by 1 person

  14. Wonderful post, Vicki. “A listening post, caring ears, ready to receive.” What a great approach; he definitely knew the answer to his own question. This young man is the kind of person you want in your organization, and I wish his boss had noticed that. As a leader, these are the kinds of discussions I was looking for — opportunities to discuss potential and next steps, whether within my organization or elsewhere, always providing support along the way.

    Liked by 1 person

    1. Ah…thank you, Edward. I imagine you were the most inspirational kind of leader. You would appreciate Martin in person, too. He is a person of character – like you! Your thoughtful comment makes me smile! 🥰

      Liked by 1 person

      1. You’re welcome, Vicki. Good luck to him, and I hope he finds the right place. A lot of potential there.

        Liked by 1 person

        1. I bet he’ll see your lovely comments! Thank you so much, Edward! 🥰

          Like

  15. petespringerauthor Avatar
    petespringerauthor

    Good for Martin to have the maturity to make a thoughtful decision instead of an emotional choice.

    Yes, we always have to be careful to make sure someone doesn’t misinterpret our actions and blur the lines. I once sold a vehicle to a single, adult woman. She had a special needs child which she brought along with her on the test drive. It was one of the weirdest experiences I’ve ever had because she drove like a bat out of hell with her son and me in the vehicle. Part of me wanted to tell her to slow down, and the other part wanted a sale. 😊

    She seemed like a nice woman even though she was an odd duck. A few days later she sent me flowers at work as a thank you gesture. Still, it was a pretty bizarre thing to do and as a happily married man, I didn’t want to blur the lines or give her a false impression so I didn’t respond after that.

    Liked by 1 person

    1. Wow! What a crazy situation! You showed more restraint than I could have! Hope she bought a car from you. 😉

      Liked by 1 person

  16. petespringerauthor Avatar
    petespringerauthor

    She did. Still, the whole experience was bizarre. A couple of days after we agreed on a price, she came to school and I signed the title over to her as her son counted out $4,000 in hundred dollar bills. Even though it was a perfectly legitimate transaction, it felt like we were doing a drug deal. I went straight to the bank after school to ensure they were good bills. (They were.)

    I’m happy for Martin and hope things work out well for him.

    Liked by 1 person

    1. Such a perfect story…demonstrating how wacky life can be! Thanks for the good wishes for Martin. 🥰 Appreciate you, Pete!

      Liked by 1 person

  17. Go, Martin! Love the way you captured his insightful and respectful thoughts and choices. He learned well from you and what a fantastic opportunity for you to see that!

    My dad used to frequently say when he went to coffee with someone who asked him for advice, “Mostly, I listened.”

    Beautiful question and post, dear Vicki!

    Liked by 1 person

    1. Thanks for the cheers for Martin and for the sweet memory of your wise and wonderful papa, Wynne. I love it! 🥰❤️🥰

      Liked by 1 person

  18. Years ago someone I respected told me that you exit any relationship, good or bad, when: 1) you’re no longer learning anything new; & 2) there’s no possibility that the other person/side is going to change. I think of that advice every so often and abide by it.

    Liked by 2 people

    1. Perfectly put…I like it and love that it’s stuck with you. Good advice! Thanks, Ally! 🥰

      Liked by 1 person

  19. I always know when it’s time to make an exit. Can’t swear they’ve all been healthy…but they sure have gotten me to where I needed to be. That is a great question, and I’m glad you were able to help him!

    Liked by 1 person

    1. Thanks so much, Mark. Yup. I’ve made some pretty terrible exits…clumsy…awkward and um…too many words spoken, shall we say? Martin’s pretty awesome…I think I’d like to vote for him, if that were an option. 😉🥰😊

      Liked by 1 person

  20. I love this story- great job Vicki & Martin!

    Liked by 1 person

    1. Thanks, Todd! You’re the best! 🥰

      Liked by 1 person

  21. Awh. Good luck to Martin. I hope you’ll follow up in a month or so to see how the new job is going. Sounds like he’s probably make the sound choice.

    Liked by 2 people

    1. Thanks so much, Betsy. He’s a wonderful human…and he’s loving his little taste of fame, LOL, by being a topic in my blog. 😁

      Liked by 1 person

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